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Discuss Class Action Lawsuit Respondents Needed at the General - Hackint0sh.org; Originally Posted by myndex However, I also believe that there are valid claims for classes ...
  1. #51
    Senior Professional Array DeadRobot's Avatar

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    Quote Originally Posted by myndex View Post

    However, I also believe that there are valid claims for classes two and three.




    A
    Hey Myndex, Can Canadian/European cousins get on board this venture or is it US only?
    Can I sync my iPhone to my Newton?


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    Default Other legal avenues


    IMHO, in addition to apparent violations of the Magnuson-Moss Warranty Act, there appear to be possible violations of the Computer Fraud and Abuse Act. Plus maybe other causes of action like trespass to chattels. I would imagine that a bright, aggressive attorney could bring a quite interesting class action case against Apple.

    It actually would be a good thing if the courts (or Congress) sorted out the rights of consumers when buying devices that have embedded software. To me, the idea that you are bound by a software license when buying a tangible consumer product doesn't pass the smell test.

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    The Manguson-Moss Warranty act is the interesting one, I skimmed the contents of this act and this sticks out at me:

    may not exclude or limit consequential damages for a breach of any written or implied warranty on the product, unless the exclusion or limitation conspicuously appears on the face of the warranty;

    Below is the link to the iPhone warranty.

    http://www.apple.com/legal/warranty/iphone.pdf

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    My problem is not that the iPhone is sold/shipped simlocked, nor the fact that Apple may be intentionally breaking people's phones/refusing warranty service on illicitly modified phones (though I would like to better understand the legality of doing that) but the fact that there appears to be no legitimate way to unlock a phone.

    Nobody has yet come forward having done an early buy-out of their contract and said Apple/AT&T unlocked the phone for them, and that's what's worrying me. If it is impossible for the operator to unlock the iPhone, it's sale may well be ILLEGAL in many European countries (although I am not well versed in everybody's law, I'm certain, for example that no locked GSM phones can even be sold in Norway), and that's certainly grounds for a lawsuit.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Azurael View Post
    My problem is not that the iPhone is sold/shipped simlocked, nor the fact that Apple may be intentionally breaking people's phones/refusing warranty service on illicitly modified phones (though I would like to better understand the legality of doing that) but the fact that there appears to be no legitimate way to unlock a phone.

    Nobody has yet come forward having done an early buy-out of their contract and said Apple/AT&T unlocked the phone for them, and that's what's worrying me. If it is impossible for the operator to unlock the iPhone, it's sale may well be ILLEGAL in many European countries (although I am not well versed in everybody's law, I'm certain, for example that no locked GSM phones can even be sold in Norway), and that's certainly grounds for a lawsuit.
    truth be told i've been waiting to hear that too. in europe once the contract is fullfilled they must unlock it upon request. for a small fee. verizon, tmo, att/cingular have all said that theyd unlock phones after the contract is fullfilled. (at&t unlocked my pantech c300 that i sold to a friend on tmobile). so by paying the early termination fee of $175 to att one would assume contract is fullfilled and they should legally unlock it right? that being said i know its not a law that they have to do it since sprint doesnt do it. and have publicly said so. so there you go.........


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    Whether we're wrong or not isn't really an issue from a marketing standpoint. Or from a PR standpoint.

    This is not a whine. I know I was taking a chance when I clicked Update. I knew the potential consequences since my phone was unlocked.

    That said: As a consumer who - for the most part - has kept my end of the bargain (My 3 iPhones were all activated on AT&T. The 2 remaining ones still are. I have legitimate iPhone data plans on 2 year contracts on all 3 of them) I still feel that the short shift I was given because the phone was hacked was wrong. I never went in there looking for a replacement. I didn't go in looking for any free (warranty) help.

    Apple has the ability to repair these phones. They'd go a lot further in their PR if they offered an option - for a fee - to restore the phones that were hacked. The analogy has been used time and again but it's the best I can think of: If I threw non standard RAM into my iMac and it crashed the system, it would be perfectly reasonable for them to say 'We told you so -now it's no longer under warranty'. But it would also be reasonable for me to expect that they repair it at the market rate for PC repairs.

    The iPhone is no different than a computer. End users will do stupid things to their computers (I do tech support - believe me I know what kinds of stupid things they can do...) They don't follow instructions and they insist on using components or software that they are told flat out will damage them. A company that refuses to repair them, even on a fee basis, isn't doing right by their customers.

    Customers are not pre schoolers that need to be taught a lesson. And not offering any remedy to the unlocked phones is the equivalent of teaching a pre schooler a lesson. "Johnny, don't go neear the stove, you'll get burned. Johnny, I'm warning you you'll get hurt. Fine, you didn't listen, you hurt your hand, now you're on your own. No bandaid for you."

    It's wrong and a policy like that is PR suicide. My guess is Steve Job's handlers and PR advisers were having coronaries this weekend.

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    Default Intent

    I have seen in a number of places the statement that intent (to damage or brick modified iPhones) is hard to prove. This statement seems to ignore the fact that once a class action suit is filed, the plaintiffs are entitled to rather extensive discovery. Think disclosure of emails and memos and depositions relating to verbal discussions. I think it is unlikely that all (any?) Apple employees will lie under oath for Steve Jobs, but, in any case, I suspect that the email and memo trail with be sufficient to establish intent.

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    This is America and people will sue over anything. It is sad that the billions of dollars siphoned out of the economy better spent in R&D, education or healthcare rather than lining the pockets of trial lawyers.

    If there is a class action lawsuit suing these class action lawyers - sign me up ASAP!

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    Quote Originally Posted by DeadRobot View Post
    Hey Myndex, Can Canadian/European cousins get on board this venture or is it US only?
    It is US only, meaning that you have to have purchased the phone in the US, and sought service in the US and were denied for one of the reasons stated.

    A

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    Quote Originally Posted by meowth View Post
    This is America and people will sue over anything. It is sad that the billions of dollars siphoned out of the economy better spent in R&D, education or healthcare rather than lining the pockets of trial lawyers.

    If there is a class action lawsuit suing these class action lawyers - sign me up ASAP!
    The right to sue is protected by the 7th amendment of the constitution.

    And lawsuits are why we have things like seatbelts and safetyglass in our cars.


    A


 

 
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