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Discuss is Installer by RiPdev obsolete? at the Free Toolchain Software (Cydia App's) - Hackint0sh.org; I mean, is it any longer needed? they only have apps that have been ported ...
  1. #1
    seseberg
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    Default is Installer by RiPdev obsolete?

    I mean, is it any longer needed? they only have apps that have been ported for installer from the cydia format acsually. Does it have anything in plus from cydia except for BUGS BUGS AND A LOT OF BUGS? if so, why is it still a part of the jailbreak process?



  2. #2
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    Quote Originally Posted by seseberg View Post
    if so, why is it still a part of the jailbreak process?
    It is not. You dont have to select it in PwnageTool (Mac) or Quickpwn (Win) it is just an option - you got the choice.
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  3. #3
    seseberg
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    how come you didn't realise I knew that?
    still, is it any good?
    know I know it was the first installer to give us the ability to jailbreak our iphones, but, now that cydia is up, is there any future for it?
    this is what jay wrote to me about it


    From:
    "Jay Freeman (saurik)" <saurik@saurik.com>
    View contact details
    To:
    sesesergiosrl@yahoo.com
    So first, to get this aside: Cydia is going to get a queue feature.

    However, and this is important: almost no one switched to Cydia due to "enhanced functionality" as it had fewer packages. The reason, meanwhile, it had fewer packages, was because it had no marketshare.

    Meanwhile, that was never the promise of Cydia at all. Cydia is about having the most powerful package management backend in existence, which in turn means that developers can construct incredibly interesting applications and extensions with it.

    This is the reason I was so angry at NullRiver, and so bothered by users, back on 1.x: NullRiver was literaly holding everyone back by putting forward an inferior product. I had to take months out of my life to rewrite Installer simply because I couldn't even package the things I was trying to distribute with it, most specifically Java.

    Had NullRiver done something intelligent early on and, for example, use APT, then I never would have worked on Cydia and would have spent my time on all the other things that need to get done, like better Java support, more tools like WinterBoard, etc..

    In fact, the only reason people switch to Cydia was because it was the only program available on 2.x when 2.x launched. People were /forced/, many kicking and screaming, to use Cydia. If you read forums and other postings from the time, people were anxiously awaiting Installer because they didn't give a flying fuck about Cydia and its better functionality.

    Until, of course, Installer took just long enough for Cydia's /actualy/ benefits to catch up. Now that developers were able to target a really awesome backend, we suddenly started all kinds of /really powerful/ things that we didn't see on 1.x. Things like WinterBoard (which blows SummerBoard out of the water) and Dock2. Since then this area has /exploded/, with almost all of the packages people actually wanting to use on a day-to-day basis being "Cydia specific".

    On top of this all, Installer 4 is written by a different group of people: RiPDev. They simply don't get it at all. They seem to feel the very essence of what has become a jailbreak application is somehow wrong. They are anti-Unix, anti-library, and anti-MobileSubstrate. They somehow feel that what end users want are simply Applications... things that they can go to the App Store to get. This has led them to release things like Pusher, which seem to be completely useless (why would I want to jailbreak my phone and then not be able to do anything different than I could with App Store?), to stop supporting their "BSD Subsystem" package entirely, and to continue to make their packaging model next to impossible to use with dependencies and conflict resolution.

    This is why you are using Cydia. Note, for example, that you /are/ using Cydia, and as there isn't a queue, it definitely isn't due to there being a queue.

    Meanwhile, I think you are blinding yourself by choosing a specific feature you want to see, and not seeing the places where Cydia /has/ revolutionized the experience: by integrating web content so powerfully into the experience. This is something that I was pioneering a while back, and something this latest release of Cydia is about to make "go nuts".

    Example: wouldn't it be awesome if there was a way to rapidly browse themes, maybe even in coverflow, from within Cydia? Without having to deal with all kinds of weird screenshot links and slowly digging through the categories? Well, that's the kind of thing that I'm working on and which is now possible due to the seriously cutting edge web integration that Cydia has.

    We are going to be seeing comments and ratings very soon (the hooks are already in Cydia), integration with systems like Facebook and many of the Google web APIs... and this is all due to my having spent the last couple months working on Cydia's browser, which is so many leightyears beyond where Installer is right now that, even if they cared about this space, they would never catch up.

    This, btw, in turn connects back with my previous point that "its about the packages". A lot of these features are things that I'm working on in coordination with developers and packagers. I have a very close working relationship with most of them (something neither NullRiver nor RiPDev ever cared about), and make certain to spend the time constructing the things that they need.

    So seriously, and to summarize, while Cydia /will/ get a queue, that was never the kind of thing people actually wanted Cydia for and still isn't now. Cydia is about having more, better programs, and having more useful information available about packages due to better coupling with both its packaging backend and now the Internet.

    -J

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    Quote Originally Posted by seseberg View Post
    how come you didn't realise I knew that?
    still, is it any good?
    know I know it was the first installer to give us the ability to jailbreak our iphones, but, now that cydia is up, is there any future for it?

    I answered your question - or at least tried it.

    Dont start one of your never ending threads again cause you are just pi..ed, ok.
    Read the stickies and search the forum before posting!
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    Young Padawan Array duck9000's Avatar

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    Thread moved to the Free Toolchain Software section
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  6. #6
    seseberg
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    dude. I asked for peoples honest opinion, since I have noticed mishpas that installer does to 2.2.1, even after a clean restore and jailbreak using quickpwn, and I wanted to know if other people are having the same issues, or something else is the problem. I clean restored again, WITHOUT installer this time, and things are MUCH better regarding cydia snappiness.

    if you can't GIVE an answer, then please, SHUT UP.
    the reason for which the threads to which wikinerd responded were neverending, was because wikinerd lied to the hackint0sh server when he named his username like that, instead of saying the truth and having wikibozo instead of wikinerd.

    please, if you can't go with the natural troubleshooting flow, retain from participating.

    Thank you.

  7. #7
    seseberg
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    oh yes, BTW, did you read what Jay wrote to me abotu installer?
    or don't you believe me and you'd like a screenshot with full headers of that mail?

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by seseberg View Post
    dude. I asked for peoples honest opinion, since I have noticed mishpas that installer does to 2.2.1, even after a clean restore and jailbreak using quickpwn, and I wanted to know if other people are having the same issues, or something else is the problem. I clean restored again, WITHOUT installer this time, and things are MUCH better regarding cydia snappiness.

    if you can't GIVE an answer, then please, SHUT UP.
    the reason for which the threads to which wikinerd responded were neverending, was because wikinerd lied to the hackint0sh server when he named his username like that, instead of saying the truth and having wikibozo instead of wikinerd.

    please, if you can't go with the natural troubleshooting flow, retain from participating.

    Thank you.
    First of all: I am not your "dude".
    Second: I dont shut up.
    Third: Stop wining around here in the forum just because you got a bad day and stop insulting other members here.

    Last not least: Thread closed.
    Read the stickies and search the forum before posting!
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